X-Ftn-To: quibbler 

quibbler  wrote:
>> >Again, you have neglected the possibility that the first fluctuation
>> >happens simultaneously with the emergence of time.
>> Exactly, because without time, there are no events,
>
>Look you stupid, fucking, moron, I just told you at least 3 times that
>time arose at the same time as the matter creation.

Listen, you ignorant, motherfucking son of a bitch, :) I told you
several times that any change of states implies time, and therefore,
if time is created with the space, it cannot exist prior to the event
of creation, and therefore the event itself can never come to be,
because everything is frozen into static nonexistence, in which there
is no change, no quantum fluctuations, nothing, and since time, space
and matter imply each other, this means that there was no space, and
no matter - not even the singularity, not even the quantums, nothing.
If you define this universe as the totality of existence, all events
freeze with the singularity, and any change of that condition is not
possible, except by external force. This is not a proof of God, but
it's reason enough not to believe that this universe came out of
nothing, or that it existed eternally. It was created, and the force
that created it was not bound by any laws of our universe, because
those laws were created with the universe. This is why any attempt to
seek God within this universe or its laws is doomed; God is the
reality of a higher order, completely unbound with this universe and
its laws.
As for the relationship of God's time and world's time, it resembles
the difference of time within a dream and physical time; in a dream,
the time came to be with the beginning of the dream, and will end when
the dreamer awakens. Deduction regarding the creation of a dream
cannot be done within the dream, because it didn't exist eternally,
nor did it create itself; it is merely a figment of the dreamer's
mind. All of that applies to our universe.

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Homepage: http://www.danijel.org