X-Ftn-To: Marcus E Engdahl 

mengdahl@cc.hut.fi (Marcus E Engdahl) wrote:
>Has it occurred to you that your theory might not be all-encompassing? You are
>trying to pass judgement on ancient religions that are supposedly very different
from the ones you are familiar with. 

I can invent any theory, for instance that the drugs are necessary in
order to bring imbalance to the carrier wave that projects us into the
matrix, and when we disrupt this wave, we will wake up in the real
world. The only important thing, in this scenario, is to take the red
pill. ;) Just where did that Morpheus guy go...

>It is common that religiously inclined
>people believe that the theoretical framework used in their own religion to be
>the *truth*. 
>It is possible that according to some theoretical framework used in
>tribel religions that the fabric of reality (or whatever) can be penetrated only
>by taking a strong psychedelic daily for a month in an initiation ritual. 

Highly unlikely. A sophisticated religion creates a sophisticated
philosophy, like hinduism, buddism or christianity. There are yogis
and arhants and mystics who had similar experiences, those experiences
were of an extremely high order, and they speak of similar things.
It's all very sophisticated and plausible. The shamanic religions,
however, mostly communicate with elementals and produce lower magic.
This is not impressive at all and gives me no reason to believe that
they attained, with their drugs, something that Shankaracarya, Krishna
or Jesus failed to attain without any drugs at all.

>These kind of things happen in Amazonas. 

I have no reason to believe that their experiences come even close to
the experiences of for instance Vivekananda, Yogananda or Ramana
Maharsi. 

>Who are we to say that their religion is in
>any way inferior to some eastern tradition? 

Well, you are obviously not competent to judge, because you don't even
believe in astral bodies. If there are no astral bodies, there is no
astral travel and therefore no shamans, and you have no point.

>>Furthermore, the thing is stored in the brain and after a while you're
>>stoned without even needing to take the stuff. This caused some guys
>>to blow their brains out.
>
>Psychedelics are not stored in the body.

Actually, LSD is crystallized in the brain, and THC is also stored.
Substances of XTC are accumulated in the bones and teeth. I don't know
about other drugs, we should consult the experts.

>>But, if you know how to look, you can see _where_ their experiences
>>take place, you can see how their higher bodies behave, and after
>>you've seen some cases, well, you decide that drugs are simply a
>>nuisance.
>
>You cannot see much without taking the psychedelic yourself.

This is bullshit.

>>Today, I think that _all_ drugs except marijuana are extremely harmful
>>and cause heavy damage to the brain,
>
>That belief is demonstrably false. Not all drugs cause brain damage.

:)) 
Prove it.

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